Dinner and a movie. It’s the classic evening out. And on our first episode of season 2 of Countless Journeys we hear from two men whose life’s work has been centred on making those two experiences a little bit more pleasurable. First we hear from renowned Montreal chef Nantha Kumar. Born in Malaysia, Nantha came to Canada in the late 1980s where he worked for several years as a journalist. He shifted gears to cooking in the 1990s, revolutionizing the food scene in Montreal’s Plateau district, and being at the forefront of the pop-up restaurant experience - decades ahead of others. “I realised long ago that having a physical restaurant was not the way to go. It's like being a D.J. you don't need your own bar. You don't need your own studio to do this.” And Salah Bachir arrived in Canada with his mother and siblings in 1965, when he was ten years old, leaving behind political tensions in Lebanon. He went on to build a hugely successful media company, Cineplex Media. He’s also a leading philanthropist and an advocate for LGBTQ rights. Salah shares the roots of his activism, beginning when he was a teenager, through to today, and the wonderful programs he has supported as Honorary Patron and fundraiser for The 519, a Toronto charity committed to the health, happiness and full participation of the LGBTQ2S communities. “There was always a sense of helping where you can help someone have a better life. And I think there were hands extended to my familyto come to and to help out here. And it's kind of almost embedded in me that if you can help you do.”
Countless Journeys Season 2
Tastemakers
Paolo
There’s nothing quite like food to bring people together.
Favourite dishes - familiar or unfamiliar flavours - even just the satisfying sound of a sizzling pan - food brings people together. Food strengthens communities, and families, and culture.
Today on Countless Journeys you’ll meet a man whose devotion to food is inspiring.
Nantha Kumar has been a fixture on the Montreal food scene for decades, an innovator of trends like the pop-up restaurant.
Nantha Kumar
I realised long ago that having a physical restaurant was not the way to go. It's like it's like being a D.J. you don't need your own bar.
So I decided, you know what? I'm going to have a virtual restaurant. I'm going to go cook in different places for different people who I don't need to pay rent.
Paolo
And Salah Bachir arrived in Canada in 1965, when he was ten years old, leaving behind political tensions in Lebanon.
He went on to build a hugely successful media company, Cineplex Media. He’s also become a leading philanthropist and an advocate for LGBTQ rights.
Salah Bachir
There was always a sense of helping where you can. Helping someone have a better life.
And I it's kind of almost embedded in me that if you can help, you do.
Paolo
Countless Journeys producer Tina Pittaway will join me a bit later on to share his story.
TAKE OPENING MONTAGE
Paolo
Welcome to season two of Countless Journeys from the Canadian Museum of Immigration at Pier 21.
My name is Paolo Pietropaolo - I’m so excited to be with you to share these inspiring stories of immigration.
My dad and his parents first touched Canadian soil at Pier 21 in 1959 after a week-long journey on the Queen Federica ocean liner from Naples. Like so many, they were escaping poverty - and they found a better life in Canada.
Pier 21 is an iconic spot for my family - and for thousands of families across Canada: and it’s a symbol of how immigration has changed Canada for the better.
On Season Two of Countless Journeys - a celebration of Canadians from all walks of life --- whose drive and determination have helped shape Canadian society.
You’ll hear from business leaders, community organizers, leaders in arts and culture, and a whole lot more. And you’ll hear amazing stories of resilience and perseverance - and passion - like the story of Nantha Kumar.
Nantha started out as a journalist in his home country Malaysia.
When he came to Canada, at first, he continued as a journalist - but then, his life took an unexpected left turn into cooking.
In the early 90s, he introduced the flavours of Malaysian street food to Montreal - and he quickly became the talk of the trendy Plateau neighbourhood.
After starting a couple of restaurants - Nantha decided some years ago that he preferred pop-ups, take-out, and catering to owning his own restaurant - long before anyone else had really adopted that approach...
an approach that many restaurants have had to quickly pivot to during the pandemic.
Nantha is also a huge supporter of the community kitchen concept.
Nantha chatted with me from Montreal’s Centrale Culinaire — a community kitchen where he cooks and teaches cooking classes.
Paolo:
It's really exciting to speak with you. I was reading all about you, and it's just marvellous to hear about how ahead of the curve you've been in terms of your business. And I want to talk about that. But before we get to that, maybe we could talk about about your childhood and where you grew up.
Nantha:
Well, I grew up in Malaysia. I was born in a rubber plantation on peninsular Malaysia, on the West Coast, really close to the Thai border. I grew up in a very multicultural, multilingual background. I speak Tamil. That's my maternal language. Went to English schools, Malay is the national language grew up speaking Alcan?? as a kid.
Fortunately, I went to English schools, which was easy for me to to to be immersed in the English language and come here and adapt easily.
Paolo
What are your earliest memories of food?
Nantha
Making fried rice. That's what you learnt to do. And then you learnt to spice up instant noodles. We used of Maggi noodles. OK, so basically it's kind of bland. So basically you put stuff in the Maggie noodles, the instant noodles to make it palatable and good. So those are the first two things you learn as a kid.
Paolo
And what were you eating as a kid? What what was your family eating?
Nantha
Oh yeah. You know, Indian food, you know, Tamil cuisine like we do, like Indian dahls, fish curry, chicken curry, lamb curry. That's it. It's a you know, the basic Indian stuff like stir fried vegetables are always the same turmeric and chilli powder and green chillies in it could be any chilli with a little bit of coconut milk and some vegetables only came in when the dry season and some vegetables came in the wet season. It was mainly a vegetarian diet that was our local seasonal kind of stuff, depending on what is growing.
Paolo
As a child, you already had sort of an understanding of where food came from and how it how it came.
Nantha
Oh, yeah, yeah. We grew our own vegetables. I grew up on a rubber plantation. My my grandfather was a gardener, so he grew stuff for us.
So we ate basically stuff that we grow. We, we had fruits, vegetables from our own little garden. You know, and when you wanted something exotic to you, you bought it from from a shop.
People sometimes they go fishing in the river, they'll come and give you stuff and they exchange stuff, you know, like people often gift you stuff that they have in their garden.
So we had we had to tamarind trees and that that tamarind tree would basically give tamarind to the entire village because that was the only family tree that even now when we go back to my village, it's the only tamarind tree around. So basically, when you have an abundance of something you share, you give it away. You don't sell.
Paolo
Sure. Yeah. That's sort of a community approach to food.
Nantha
Yeah. And that was you know, that's what people did.
Paolo
That's sounds delicious.
Nantha
You learn pickling, you learn pickling and preserves immediately.
You know, when you get like when all the limes covering all the mangoes are dropping off, what do you do? You start pickling them.You make hacheri (?), you know, you make pickles.
Paolo
Did you know then that you that you had an interest in in cooking?
Nantha
No, not really. No, no. It wasn't until I actually came to Montreal that I actually started cooking again, you know.
Paolo
And so when did you when did you come to Canada?
Nantha
I came to Canada in 1982. I came to Canada because of Canada World Youth, I met somebody, my ex wife, she she was a participant with Canada World Youth. And my best friend was in a group with with Lynne, my wife. And she decided that she would come and live with me.
And then we both moved to Canada in nineteen eighty two.
Paolo
And what were your first impressions when you arrived?
Nantha
You know, everything was very new and everything was very different. I'm from a small town in Malaysia and before that I grew up in a rubber plantation. So everything was kind of weird and everything was very big for me, you know? I could have moved to the big city in Kuala Lumpur, but I was afraid of going to Kuala Lumpur with such a big city for me. And then I come to Canada.
I come to Montreal and realise, like, whoa, this is a much bigger city than Kuala Lumpur. And I had no idea how big it was. But for me for me, it's still a big city, you know.
Paolo
So you arrive and you're in this big city. How did you make plans about what to do in your new life, in your new country?
Nantha
You know what everything was like for me, It was i was fresh, you know. Yeah.
I was given the opportunity to do and learn whatever I wanted, you know, and Lynn basically said, you can go to university if you want. You just do what you want. My priority was to learn French, and that was my priority, and she said, yeah, you should do that. Because my biggest frustration was not understanding what people are talking about.
And so so my priority was to learn, learn French. So I signed up for a couple of COFI classes, which is French, a French class for immigrants. And I did that like night classes like five nights a week for like maybe for a full year. And then I signed on to Dawson college and I started going to CEGEP.
And through that I got a bursary to go study French as a second language in Chicoutimi. And I went there for one summer, like for about two months, and I came back speaking French. It really works. Yeah. You know, it's one of those intensive immersion courses. They really work.
You have to be away from Montreal, where nobody speaks English. And you know what? You come back. Speaking French language is what is how you get to know people in the culture, you know
Paolo
For sure.So you arrive in Montreal, you you immerse yourself in French culture and language. You get to know the city and then you end up as a journalist. How did that happen?
Nantha:
Well, the thing is, I worked as a journalist in Malaysia before before coming here. so interesting times, working as a young journalist and decided I’ll go to Concordia. And I applied to the journalism and got accepted. And I got to studying that full time.
And during that time, I got hired by Quebec Immigration to work as a translator from Tamil to French because they had one translator who was translating from Tamil to French. And they needed a second one because that was the the heydays of Sri Lankan Tamils immigration to Canada.
So while going to school at Concordia Journalism at night, I was working full time as a translator.
Paolo : Amazing.
Nantha : yeah, so it's not easy, but I did it.
Paolo : Did you have kids at the time as well?
Nantha :
Yes, yes, yes. I had two kids - two infants at that time. So I managed to finish college under them. And then I had to quit immigration because, you know, I had to take up I got my internship at the Globe and Mail in nineteen eighty nine. So I went to Toronto to do my internship, so after that, I came back and I was hired by the Mirror to be a full time journalist.
So having my immigration background, I was able to do stuff about refugees and about immigration policy, and then I started immersing myself in the cultural communities, and back then there was a lot of shootings by police. And so I basically took over the race relations stuff.
And I kind of specialised in that for a while. So that was what I was writing about. And after that, Hour Magazine started. And they were looking for somebody who wanted to jump ship from the Mirror to Hour and I was the perfect candidate. So I started writing for Hour magazine. They gave me a column called The Refugee of the Week, and I also got to do the restaurant reviews, which is great. So I could write about food and refugees.
Paolo
Wow. You had a whole career, a whole journalism career. Sounds like a very strong one.
Nantha
Yeah, yeah. So it was that that is basically that's what I did for most of my adult life in Montreal, being a journalist, writing about race relations, about refugees, about immigration.
And but I was always cooking on the side, cooking for friends, cooking for catering little gigs here and there, but always just for fun.
But during one of my restaurant reviews, I wrote about Elsa’s, that was how everything shifted. When I wrote about Elsa’s Bar. And then her chefs kind of quit on her. She asked me to come and do like a two nights, three nights at the bar. I said no.
I said, look, I've never cooked in a restaurant. She said, no, it's fine. Just come and cook a couple of dishes. I said, no, no. I resisted for about two weeks. And then she eventually one of the nights I was there, she gave me three hundred dollars.
She said, look, tomorrow you're going to go to Chinatown and buy some groceries, come back and cook.
You're going to cook. What do you what do you like what are you good at cooking?
I say I like to make ???. Yeah. She said, oh yeah. You're going to make that noodle dish and then make two curries. And that's what I did.
So it started out like that, I just three-hundred dollars, bought some groceries, cooked, I didn't have a menu, didn't have nothing. I just cooked.
And basically, my friends who were journalists who were hanging out at the bar ate my food for the first few weeks. And then Achaud (?) Changwani (?)wrote about it for the Gazette - the late journalist Achaud (?) Changwani (?) wrote “Journalist is Cooking at Elsa’s.” And then you know what the rest is history. It just blew up.
I was getting write ups in the La Presse and Journal de Montreal, and before you knew it, my whole career changed. So I started cooking for Elsa’s on Thursday, Friday, Saturday, three nights a week for like, what, three months?
And it became four nights a week. And then after that, I move on to St. Laurent and I started cooking at the Copacabana and then it just blew up, just like I was cooking five days a week.
I was doing two columns for the magazine doing Refugee of the Week and doing the restaurant reviews. And on top of that, I still had to write some news articles and after about two years, it just became too much. I slowly started cutting down the articles I was writing and then just devoted my time eventually to just full time cooking.
Paolo
And then you had a restaurant and then you decided to close it and do this thing.
Nantha
Yes, exactly. Like I realised long ago that having a physical restaurant was not the way to go. It's like it's like being a D.J. you don't need your own bar. You don't need your own studio to to to do this.
So I decided, you know what? I'm going to have a virtual restaurant. I'm going to go cook in different places for different people who I don't need to pay rent.
And I started that way, way ahead of time, like I had pop ups and I had pop ups in Vancouver like twenty five years ago, even before it was called a pop up. I was a guest chef in Vancouver and I decided I could do that. I did that twenty five years ago.
I went to cook for three days in a restaurant, someone else's restaurant. I cooked my own food to two different services and I was able to fill up the place, just word of mouth, putting up posters, getting getting written up.
Paolo
Has anyone come to you during this pandemic for advice because of your experience.
Nantha
Yes, people have reached out to me. People like who want to do like frozen food and that's the way to go, take away food.
I mean, the whole the whole coworking kitchen space, like the Central Command is there to help people do that.
You know, where two people can come, set up, make food for 30 people and they can come pick it up or drop it off.
And then, you know, then you don't have then you can work on something else for the next five days because you have to do that five days a week. And it's a full time restaurant. Yes.
And here we allow people to come and have a line of marmalade, start a line of pickles or whatever. So this is like a like an incubator kind of place where you can actually start making stuff. But right now, we don't want to put anybody's life at risk, you know?
Paolo Absolutely.
Nantha
So so right now, you know, a period of reflection, cleaning up the place, keeping it safe, and when all this thing blows over, will slowly come back.
Yeah, and I think that is I think that's a logical choice, you know. I do miss my contact with the people when we do the pop ups here.
We do it once a month. We get about 30 to 40 people to come in, sit, come and sit down. We serve them food. We have a great time. We have nice music. You know, we drink and we have a party. We dance. But we can do that right now, you know?
I'm just glad that we're here and that we can be safe and and we can continue to do a lot of things that a lot of people can’t do in other countries.
Paolo We're lucky.
Nantha We are so lucky, you know.
Paolo Ya.
Nantha Like, seriously.
MUSIC BRIDGE
Paolo
Countless Journeys producer Tina Pittaway joins me now. Hey Tina!
Tina
Hey Paolo! So great to be back in the saddle for Season 2!
And what a neat guy Nantha is - he has such an interesting backstory it has me craving being back in restaurants with people and sharing meals again.
Paolo
No kidding, I got hungry while I was speaking to him.
I was so taken with his energy and his enthusiasm, not to mention his ability to pivot, long before pivoting was the catch phrase that has become today. And innovation is a theme today on countless journeys. And you've got the story of another Canadian now who's really an innovator as well.
Tina
I do. Salah Bachir is well-known in Canada for being a longtime patron of the arts. Currently he’s the chancellor of OCAD University in Toronto, the country’s largest art, design and media university.
You know it was interesting listening to Nantha’s story because both of these men have roots in journalism.
And Salah will tell us a bit more about that in a few moments.
Salah Bachir was at the forefront of the home video industry back in the early eighties. He developed partnerships with movie studios and theater chains with distribution and publishing deals.
He is a recipient of the Order of Canada, among many other accolades, both for his work as a businessman, and also for his advocacy and his legendary fundraising abilities. He’s done incredible work for causes close to his heart, particularly in areas of social justice, LGBTQ rights and the arts.
PAOLO VO
He sounds like an extraordinary guy.
I can’t wait to get to know him better. His family is from Lebanon, right?
TINA VO
Yes - his father moved here first, on his own.
Salah Bachir
my dad came here in 1960 and my mom didn't want to come and he came here to avoid what he foresaw would be a civil war in Lebanon, which did happen.
In nineteen fifty eight Americans had landed ten thousand Marines in Beirut and he didn't think the situation was too stable and wanted us to come to Canada.
TINA VO
So in 1965, Salah’s mother agreed to make the move. She and Salah and his four brothers and sisters came to Canada, settling in the Rexdale neighbourhood of Toronto.
And he was raised with a real sense of community involvement - taking care of others was a big part of his family’s values.
Salah Bachir
There was always a sense of helping where you can help someone have a better life. And I I think there were hands extended to my family that, you know, to come to and to help out here. And so we wouldn't be part of an impending war in Lebanon.
And it's kind of almost embedded in me that if you can help you do. And I recall from days, even as a little child, were in communities with my grandmother be a lot of people would be baking together and cooking together and making stuff together. And then we would be sent off with packages to different families in the neighborhood and whether in Christmas or Easter or any other times.
Paolo
Isn't that interesting? You know, it strikes me that food, again, is at the heart of of communities and bringing communities together, but also it sounds like there is a real sense of of being a part of something and contributing to a community and his family from a really early age, which plays kind of into his his history as an activist, I guess. So what were some of the earliest causes that he got behind?
Tina
Well one of his earliest protests that he was involved with was when he was 15.
Paolo: Fifteen!
TIna: I know - young roots!
He picketed outside a Dominion grocery store, in support of the United Farm Workers and in support of the labour leader, Cesar Chavez. That was also one of his first efforts at fundraising - something he has been incredibly successful at in the decades since.
And in that protest he raised $150 for the cause, and actually presented it in person to Chavez.
Paolo:
And I was reading that Chavez actually said that that’s $150 more than we had this morning.
Good for him!
Tina
Yeah those moments when you are young can clearly have a big impact on you and Salah went on to study history and political science at the University of Waterloo. This was in the mid-seventies.
Salah Bachir
I was a Marxist in university and but I in my second year, I stayed at a Mennonite college in Waterloo. And I love the sense of community among the Mennonites. And I love the openness. I love the idea that we could sit there. Almost like a like any table in the Middle East or Mediterranean without fighting with each other and over food, discuss different ideas and different ways.
Tina
During that time, university campuses saw a rise in student activism, and the University of Waterloo was no exception.
Salah was part of a group of students who actually occupied the offices of the student paper there, as part of a broader political protest.
Salah Bachir
We had occupied the student newspaper in Waterloo for nine months and I had learned how to put a paper together and sold advertising and did a bunch of stuff.
Paolo: Nine months -
Ah, so this was his first foray into journalism.
Tina
Yes it was, and it served him well a couple of years later when his brother opened up what was one of Canada’s
Salah Bachir
So I was running a community center in Toronto part time and freelancing, writing articles and putting a couple for the Toronto Star. And he was being encouraged by different people to put out like a newsletter or magazine to get people more interested.
And I said I could run it for him. And and I did it while running his store and freelancing. And that magazine became Video Mania around nineteen eighty eighty one.
And then several people as the video industry took off, told us, you don't want a consumer magazine, but a trade magazine would be better.
Tina
So Salah launched a trade magazine, and then,he and his brother worked with Universal to launch the home video end of their business, and partnered with Disney on that front as well.
And a few years later, in 1999, he launched Famous Magazine, which was distributed in Famous Players’ theatres.
Paolo:
I remember that magazine! I’d always grab a copy on the way into the cinema so there was something to read while waiting for the movie to start. And wow - so he was really at the forefront of that whole pivot to video.
TINA VO
He was.
And that success eventually led to a business partnership with entertainment giant Viacom - and that resulted in Salah becoming president of Famous Players Media. He ended up becoming a 49% owner.
Famous Players eventually morphed into Cineplex Media, which Salah still leads. Under Salah’s direction, movie theater advertising underwent a huge shift both creatively as well as in terms of profitability.
Salah Bachir
in some ways, I got into the video industry by accident and journalism by accident.
I've always loved film. I've always, so it was almost, what's that line, you put somebody in water and they realize we love to swim kind of thing and any exposure to the arts, I thought the arts were the most freeing of things.
Paolo:
And what was the reaction within his family to Salah’s growing success?
Tina
Well he tells this terrific story about getting a very lucrative offer, that would have meant moving to California.
Salah:
I think I was thirty three at the time and got a huge offer from Los in Los Angeles. And we'd have family dinners on Sundays
And I told my brothers and told my sister about it and mentioned it briefly to my dad and everyone is very proud about it and the whole bit.
My mom was one of the most generous, kindest people you've ever met.
My mom served dinner and sat down and she was very quiet throughout the whole thing, and this was huge, like it was a huge career and it's one of the major studios and everything.
And she looked at me and said, we did not all leave our family, our friends, you know, learn a new language and do everything so any of you could leave home.
Like in your heart, it's like what? So in a way that was such a passion and love for Canada that none of the kids actually even left Toronto. And for a period of time, four of the five kids and my mom lived in the same building. And so the opportunities were amazing
There there is not enough I can say about Canada.
Paolo VO
You mentioned that Salah has been a longtime fundraiser and advocate for the LGBTQ community. Can you tell me more about that?
TINA VO
Yes. Salah’s own story about coming out to his family is really wonderful - a contrast to many stories we hear about people being rejected.
[00:09:56]
A very young age, I think I had to probably when I was six or seven. I knew I was different, that that I was gay
I know from a lot of people that I had a different experience. coming out to my parents was a non event.
As a friend once said to me, it's like almost my parents said to me, we knew you were gay. When did you find out? And my mom said to me, all I want for you is to have someone who brings you half the joy and love that you brought us in your life.
And even family, when my husband Jacob and I go back to a small village and you don't think of Lebanon as being open, But all of my relatives and friends and even on phone calls today will ask, how is Jacob, how are things? And and over the years been totally open. And there's a lot of different gay and lesbian organizations that we support in the Middle East.
TINA
Over the years, Salah has helped to raise tens of millions of dollars for a real variety of causes.
Many are in the arts, as well as healthcare. One organization that he has been really involved with is the 519 Community Centre. The 519 works towards advancing LGBTQ equality and inclusion in Toronto.
Paolo: It’s over on Church Street.
Tina:
It runs dozens of support programs. One is the LGBTQ Refugee Support group, which provides access to counsellors for newcomers who may be struggling with coming out.
He shared with me a story about being approached one evening when he was headed out to dinner with his husband Jacob.
Salah Bachir
one time we're going for dinner and this young East Indian man approached me and said, I need to talk to you about the five 19.
And he was kind emotional.
He said, When I came out to my parents, we went to a counselor at the 519 and my grandmother came along. And
the counselor turned out to be from the village next door to our village in India. And so him and my grandmother knew some people, he spoke to her in her native language. We talked and before I could get to any of my issues, my grandmother said, we're in a different country and this is a different times and we love you and let's go.
I mean, I still cry telling that story, actually.
Paolo
Thank you so much for bringing us Salah’s story.
TINA VO
My pleasure.
PAOLO VO
This year the Canadian Museum of Immigration is launching a new exhibit.
The exhibit features an immersive film…
Tanya Bouchard:
And this film is a 10 minute experience about contributions. And it's the specifically the contributions of generations of immigrants and how they shape Canada. [00:03:54][12.3]
PAOLO VO
Tanya Bouchard is the vice president of exhibitions, research and collections at the museum.
Tanya Bouchard
So when they walk into this new zone, they'll see an open space with a very large curved screen that's about 180 degrees and kind of wraps around you. And on that screen, which is nine foot tall screen, nine feet tall, you will see images and clips and a lot of animation bringing it all together.
With an immersive experience you really want to feel like you're part of it, like you're in the middle of it, and just the sheer size of the screen surrounding you and many images and clips and soundscapes, it really feels like you're really connected in the middle of the content.
PAOLO VO
And it’s a celebration of many of the themes and people you’ll be hearing about this season on Countless Journeys.
Tanya Bouchard:
we're looking at the theme of contributions of immigrants to Canada and one of the first themes and we explore is family. And we felt that family is a key theme because many people can connect.
On that theme of family, you know, we look at how families make significant contributions to Canadian society, both economically and socially through really through images and moments.
Also, their leadership and courage and strength has paved the way to create opportunities for others. So learning about their contributions can also inspire other people.
And we look at six themes, including family, the other themes, our sense of place, which is looking at creating a home, establishing yourself in a community, creating belonging. And we also look at economy and labour ideas and innovation and culture and sports and all course for these we we want to make sure we highlighted different types of contributions, different types of success and contribution through time and different fields.
PAOLO VO
Tanya Bouchard is the Vice President of exhibitions, research and collections at The museum.
CLOSING CREDITS